A few weeks ago I wrote about a possible Moneygram ban on churners buying money orders at Walmart. At the time, I was getting flooded with reports from readers who had tried to purchase money orders over $1,000 (which triggers an ID check) and were told they couldn’t buy money orders because of a message popping up on the screen.
Based on the volume these people reported doing, I assumed I was banned too. So last week I tried to buy $2,000+ worth of money orders and was able to do so without problems.
I tried this at a Supercenter that I normally don’t go to since the lines are usually out the door. I figured if I was banned from buying money orders, at least the people at my Neighborhood Market won’t know that. On the other hand, I was totally fine with not being able to return to the Supercenter.
I not only found out I wasn’t banned from buying money orders, but I stumbled across a time when this location isn’t insanely busy. And now I have two MS-friendly Walmart stores where I can liquidate Visa gift cards.
Reports of churners getting banned
There has been some speculation about what might be at play here. I mentioned in my previous post that I reached out to a contact at Walmart who did not have any knowledge of the company banning churners.
He did speculate that the bans may be location-specific. For the record, I’m in Northern California. One of my readers from California reported being banned, though I wasn’t able to verify which area he was from.
For now, we can breathe easy knowing that Moneygram hasn’t implemented system-wide bans on frequent churners. This isn’t comforting for those who’ve reported not being able to buy money orders over $1,000 anymore, but for the rest of us, it offers some relief.
Another rumor
Despite the good news, we’re not all in the clear. There’s now a rumor going around that Walmart’s systems will be updated to require ID checks on money order purchases over $100. That number is not missing a zero, by the way.
It’s not a problem for those of us liquidating multiple $1,000 Simon Visa gift cards at a time. Those purchases trigger the ID checks anyway, so it will be business as usual.
Those who believe they’ve been placed on a “banned” list by either Walmart or Moneygram won’t like this. If this goes into effect, they won’t be able to liquidate Visa gift cards at all.
It’s hardly worth it to liquidate a $1,000 Visa gift card in $99 increments. So if this goes into effect, those people who’ve been circumventing the ban by purchasing money orders in increments under $1,000 will pretty much be out of business.
Final thoughts
While nothing has been confirmed, it’s always best to be prepared. Just assume everything I wrote about goes into effect tomorrow. Are you prepared? Go about your MS routine as if you’ll get shut down tomorrow: Don’t let gift cards pile up and liquidate them as soon as you get them. Don’t buy more than you can afford to get stuck with. More importantly, have a back-up plan.
Have you guys heard anything about the $100 trigger on Walmart money orders? If you’ve been banned, please share your (approximate) location in the comments so we can keep track of where people are being affected.
It happened to me last Sunday @ Folsom near the outlet mall. This was my only third time here. I tried to buy 3K, and when the cashier looked at me after taking my license down, I had that sinking feeling… Thanks.
I wasn’t shut down but asked for my ID( computer required it) when I asked for a 999.11 MO. Had that sinking feeling I’d get shut down after she entered my info, but it let the transaction proceed. First time at this WM in Loveland Co that this happened under the 1k number. Now I’m worried next time I might be banned completely. Thankfully that was the last of my VGC .
The WMT – the only one of the 5 that do the MO trick only allows I think $850 – maybe $900. They get my ID for any amount so I am used to that. I am thinking of doing a smallish SM run this weekend and will ask for something like 4 750 MOs or maybe if I push 5 – $800 MOs . Like Ariana says in the post – don’t take out what you cannot move. I do have two grocery stores as well.
I was banned with Moneygram (not Walmart) here in Southern California. Fortunately you can at least buy under $1,000 without giving ID so I’m stuck only doing $999.12 at a time. They only allow you to go once per day (or at least they say once per shift). She said some people come during other shifts.
Billpay still works which is not made through Moneygram. That’s how I know it’s not Walmart banning but Moneygram. A friend told me that they are going down the list and looking for people that constantly get $999.12 so I’d just mix up the amounts and get solid number money orders. 3 $1,000 and 1 $995 and then just liquidate the small balance on Amazon. That probably is safer.
I recently went to a WMNM and asked for a money order for 599.12, she asked for my ID? I said I forgot it in my car and left. Came back the next day liquidated the same amount with a different cashier. Came back another day and asked for 599.12 MO and again was asked for ID. I said okay this single time but asked why, the rep responded sometimes it just comes up asking for ID randomly. I hadn’t seen her before so I’m not sure if she was just saying that or not. But can anyone tell me why I got asked for ID one day and not the next for the same amount that was under $1k?
It can indeed be random but the CSR can also trigger it with 1 key if they are suspicious.
I reported earlier about the $100 future limit. A WM rep told me she learned it at a training session. She had no timeline for it but only said “after they update the system”. This is truly a rumor but I have no reason to doubt her.
I am banned from a Walmart in North Florida. But I haven’t pushed it with other Walmarts to find out if I am banned everywhere. But I’m caring much less about it these days.
I am doing most my liquidation at Publix and Winn-Dixie these days. It cost a little more but the print is better and facilitates auto deposits.
I reported earlier about the $100 future limit. A WM rep told me she learned it at a training session. She had no timeline for it but only said “after they update the system”. This is truly a rumor but I have no reason to doubt her.
I am banned from a Walmart in North Florida. But I haven’t pushed it with other Walmarts to find out if I am banned everywhere. But I’m caring much less about it these days.
I am doing most my liquidation at Publix and Winn-Dixie these days. It cost a little more but the print is better and facilitates auto deposits.
Nice piece on business insider btw
I used to do tons of money orders with Visa Vanilla cards years ago at Walmart. They they coded that out and I could no longer do them. What is up with the Gift Card to Money order situation now at Walmarts. I would love to know.
Potentially this could be very positive. By actually having a system and allowing use with ID this could be like CVS, where you need ID, they have a max daily limit but it is now ‘normal’ so the whole ‘real debit’ only goes away.
I’ve been doing $25,000 to $40,000 per month between the Simon Mall promo, Staples, and GCM / Giftcards.com with the majority being liquidated at WMT through MO purchases.
@Ed. C – why is this significant in any way? If you said you did X volume, usually in XX increments and still aren’t banned, then that is something…not much, but at least something. Just listing your volume is a waste of space. It doesn’t say anything useful.
@Thomas – Sorry I offended you, but your comment wasted space.
@Thomas — For the record, your comment wasted space.
Yea, good news for No. CA. Thx!
Hi Ariana. When you say you thought you were banned at WM for MOs, did you actually confirm multiple times before if you were ever banned? Or was this the first time you have tried to buy >$1K MOs in a long time since Sept 16th when the ban originally occurred. The reason I ask is because its been about a month since the ban originally occurred so I found it odd that you just were confirming now that you have not been banned.
Just trying to confirm if the ID check ban is a particular WM store specific ban or WM system ban. Any clarification is appreciated.
What if you’ve NEVER done any of it before and wanted to get starting at WM? What would you recommend on 10-15-2019? Thinking about trying it but don’t want to buy $10,000 in VGC only to be banned after liquidating the first two $1,000 cards. Newbie looking for suggestions to NOT get burned right out of the gate. .
This is just my opinion but I would advise if you have never bought a MO before to start off by buying 1 MO without splitting card to get comfortable in the process and avoid doing an ID check.
My second piece of advice that once you get done it several times and feel comfortable I would stick with $2K Mo transactions. I would avoid buying >$3K in MOs in a single transaction to avoid entering your SSN.
You are not going to get banned after 2 $1K transactions so you don’t have to worry. We don’t know what triggers it but we can guess its based on volume you have done over a period of time (ex: If you are doing $4K to $8K per day you are more likely to get banned at some point vs someone who is doing $1K – 2K per day).
Eric: This is awesome advice and I appreciate it. That’s exactly how I’ll start out!!! I appreciate the feedback!!!
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You douche bags are fearmongers who spread false information.
Who is fear-mongering? This is actually happening. Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt.
The ID thing for MOs over $100 was started by million miles guy based on what he was told by a cust service associate. I go daily to that store he was told that and that particular associate makes up stories quite frequently as she does not want to do single MOs for regular MS-ers that do the usual limits of 2/4 cards as well. She had mentioned this to me about a month ago as well but I dismissed it as I know her background. Its one of the rare stores that lets you do multiple transactions with ID (by going back in line after each transaction). I have asked around all other assoc and front end mgrs I am friends with and none had heard this and they laughed when I told them which assoc told me that little upcoming secret (never brought up the blog from mmg)…
That’s good to know!
John – So grateful to you for sharing your insight – thank you, thank you, thank you!
Buying my $3k MOs yesterday the clerk spend a couple of minutes rapidly typing something onto the screen (not my drivers license information). I asked and she said “just responding to the onscreen prompts, sir”. Wonder what that’s about. Bracing for shutdown.
most likely she was submitting an SAR (suspicious activity report)
I hope not!
Just happened to me too. Tried my regular biweekly 3K (which had worked up until 2 weeks ago) and I got the decline message. I tried again today with different amounts (thinking, perhaps the decline message was triggered by suspicious amounts) and didnt work either. Also, my once friendly WMT is now being instructed to verify the debit card being used and to also decline any <$1K MO if ID and name on card do not match. Seems this is really getting tough. This was in Austin, TX
Finally happened to me yesterday. I want to say it was somehow volume related as my spreadsheets suggest I’ve just crossed the 100k threshold of ID required purchases in the last week or so, but I know that can’t be the case since others have been doing that monthly for years.
A familiar CSR scanned my ID then started typing a bunch of numbers and some other things on the screen- didn’t seem phased by any of it. Once she was done she clicked what I assume was total and her face changed. She said she can’t sell me any money orders. Told me she can’t tell me the reason. I asked if said to “politely tell the customer you cannot sell them money orders” and she didn’t confirm or deny.
Luckily I focused on MS before ever getting into churning so I still have some opportunities in this game, but this hit hurts with how profitable things have been recently. I’m sure this will drive too many people over to the very few grocery stores that are available in my small midwestern city and I’ll be forced to get creative going forward.
At the Simon Mall the other day – the associate asked if about adding my name to the “preferred customer” list so I didn’t need to fill out the form each time. I do keep my Simon Mall purchases pretty small – maybe one per week 3-5 cards a visit. But I got the name of the General Manager and I asked if SM ever thought of adding money order process. Its been discussed but nothing yet. That would be the best scenario if that ever happened. I would even pay more than I pay at the grocery store or WMT for a money order just for the convenience of not having to driver 12-15 miles to the stores I am able to use.
I haven’t been to a WM in 2 months. Went to buy 2 @ $999.12 in Alabama location and told system wouldn’t sell to me. So not volume related is my assumption.
Were you doing large volumes before that? You’re the second person from Alabama I’ve heard from who got banned from WM.
Tonight I encountered something potentially just as, if not more so, problematic…. (at a Wmt in central Virginia that until now had generally been…. not hostile…. to ms) Tonight, I was only buying a single $900 mo. The clerk asked what it was for…. I said, paying bills. He said fine and we moved on to liquidating my 3 debit cards.
But another supervisor csr next to him scolded him for not being specific enough about just who the money order will be made out to…. He looked shocked (as I was I), and then she went on (in the same scolding tone) saying that this was hard-coded now into all WMT cash registers . (thought I heard her say, “as of today” — not sure)
Again, the first rep. seemed dubious, and proceeded to complete the transaction…. which not to his colleague’s surprise, read “bill pay” on the “To” line…. (rendering it unusable to me) We then had to void the transaction…. I got it to work (barely) by saying the bill pay was from my checking account — wherein I would be depositing my mo (made out to me). By this time the other csr was getting really testy…. but she didn’t block the transaction… this time. (the first csr remained polite and apologetic, but who knows)
This was just for one mo. Anybody else encountering this requirement as of today? (or has this been around for awhile?) What’s the common strategy….?
(other than going to a grocery store…. speaking of which, here in Hoo’ville tonight, I also encountered a fellow hacker who managed to buy THREE money orders for $749.49 each…. all in one transaction, and paid for with a pile of $200 (staples origin) vgc’s….. Took him forever. (and I suspect he was getting away with the abuse of the Kroger policy, as the csr was new) Arrogant so and so’s like that will kill Kroger too.
My first longer post didn’t work, so here’s short version: At my central virginia wmt (hoo’ville), I tonight encountered a hard-coded requirement that not only did I have to specify who the money order was going to, but that this exact name printed out on my money order. CSR said it was very new policy, (the first CSR had not known of it)….
Went to WM yesterday to do 999.10 MO , clerk asked for my ID. Only 2nd time that’s happened. She said it’s now a requirement for all MO as of Nov 1st
Anyone else seeing this?
It has been more than 6 months since the last post.
I wanted to ask Ariana are you still able to liquidate VDC at your 2 ms friendly Walmarts?
If yes what quantities and how often?
I was doing large quantities but the store is now having eMSAR completed
with any amount over 1000.
I don’t want to get banned and I’m also in northern California.
Any advice?
Yes, but there is one notable problem: Split payments don’t work anymore.
Does that mean you’re only buying $1000 money orders so you don’t have to complete an eMSAR?
If you can’t do split payments does that means no more $200×4 to earn 5x with Ink cards?